296 replies to this topic

[malydok]

1. we are so highly inteligent, to keep our mind in balance, we look for purpose to compensate
for our meaningless existance

And if someone isn't moved by the thought of meaningles existence he becomes a Richard.
Be fucking honest with it: live and die, there's nothing more so just fuck it, eh? Most people don't think like this and that's why religion is still there.

[azzy]

And if someone isn't moved by the thought of meaningles existence he becomes a Richard.
Be fucking honest with it: live and die, there's nothing more so just fuck it, eh? Most people don't think like this and that's why religion is still there.

That's a little short minded, religion is what brought people together, the cause of many good things and an excuse for war of course. A life without religion would be the same, people would still murder, would still war, but not in name of God or Allah. For some people religion is a hold onto something, poor people, people who lost somebody.. or have an illness which cannot be cured find hope in religion.. many people need it tbh.

I'm a non-believer, but I wouldn't want religion to fade away.

[doctorfunk]

no records that i know of jesus other then biblical shit so show me proof im not saying there isnt any tho

Tacitus (c. 56–c. 117) included in his Annals
"Nero fastened the guilt of starting the blaze and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians [Chrestians] by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius 14–37 at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular."

Pliny the Younger (c. 61 - c. 112)wrote to Emperor Trajan
"Those who denied that they were or had been Christians, when they invoked the gods in words dictated by me, offered prayer with incense and wine to your image, which I had ordered to be brought for this purpose together with statues of the gods, and moreover cursed Christ — none of which those who are really Christians, it is said, can be forced to do — these I thought should be discharged. Others named by the informer declared that they were Christians, but then denied it, asserting that they had been but had ceased to be, some three years before, others many years, some as much as twenty-five years. They all worshiped your image and the statues of the gods, and cursed Christ."

While imprisoned by the Romans, Mara wrote a letter(about 73) to his son that includes the following text:
"For what benefit did the Athenians obtain by putting Socrates to death, seeing that they received as retribution for it famine and pestilence? Or the people of Samos by the burning of Pythagoras, seeing that in one hour the whole of their country was covered with sand? Or the Jews by the murder of their Wise King, seeing that from that very time their kingdom was driven away from them? For with justice did God grant a recompense to the wisdom of all three of them. For the Athenians died by famine; and the people of Samos were covered by the sea without remedy; and the Jews, brought to desolation and expelled from their kingdom, are driven away into every land. Nay, Socrates did “not” die, because of Plato; nor yet Pythagoras, because of the statue of Hera; nor yet the Wise King, because of the new laws which he enacted."

They lived however after Jesus died(if he lived), so they may have been repeating what they heard about christians/jesus etc,
not what really happened. There are some other sources too. I have no reason to believe christians came up with the story,
since I'm not really into Iluminati.

[malydok]

That's a little short minded, religion is what brought people together, the cause of many good things and an excuse for war of course. A life without religion would be the same, people would still murder, would still war, but not in name of God or Allah. For some people religion is a hold onto something, poor people, people who lost somebody.. or have an illness which cannot be cured find hope in religion.. many people need it tbh.

I'm a non-believer, but I wouldn't want religion to fade away.

I'm not relating to the origins of religion, but 21st century. What you're saying is totally true but what I'm trying to say here is that religion is for weak people. You just confirmed it. Of course, that's not always the case and I'm totally aware of it.

@Foxdie
Jesus is a confirmed historical person. He sure was a prophet. What's not sure though is him being the Son of God, who raised from the dead and did miracles.

Edited by malydok, 29 June 2010 - 11:03 PM.

[doctorfunk]

That's a little short minded, religion is what brought people together, the cause of many good things and an excuse for war of course. A life without religion would be the same, people would still murder, would still war, but not in name of God or Allah. For some people religion is a hold onto something, poor people, people who lost somebody.. or have an illness which cannot be cured find hope in religion.. many people need it tbh.

I agree with this statement.
In fact from the political point of view religion is what brought people to make huge societies, it's one of the fundamentals
of the civilization. Like how would you bring thousands of people to build irrigation system in middle east 10k yrs ago?
Pharoah was in good position to justify his position by saying he is a god.
Now in europe religion is obsolete in pushing the civilization further, but once it was a thing that helped to get people
out of wild and build wonderful things.

lmfao @ people thinking religion is the cause of all wars
last time i checked it was about territory or money with religion used as an excuse

obviously
but being different is what create tension between ethnic groups religion is part of that,
but so is skin color or even length of your hair as we often see on demobase :S
Generally speaking it is mostly relgion used as excuse for some other more
human motives; money, land etc So religion(or ideology like in nazi's case) is more of a tool used by politicians
to justify wars

[maniman]

ye

Edited by mani-tzu, 30 June 2010 - 05:38 PM.

[Juul]

if thats so mani, why am i no god yet?

[maniman]

ye

Edited by mani-tzu, 30 June 2010 - 05:38 PM.

[Richard]

you serious :S
Science in general deals tries to anwser question "how?", religion basically tries to show meaning of our existance so
more or less question "why?". You can't prove religion wrong by science, since they operate in different fields.
Secondly stuff written in Bible is not in all cases to be interpreted literally. Creationist or people who believe Earth is flat
are a minority where you can say science proves them wrong, but it is far from how modern believers think about God
and Religion.

"Why" questions are philosofical questions and they don't require a god or a religion to be answered. You can be philosofical without having any form of religion, by believing whats in those books people just brainwash themselfs to answer questions of which you are scared to know the actual answer of. Its no problem, I don't mind people believe in such things, I would just like them to keep it for themselfs and not trying to push it on on others.

I'm only 22 years old, still a young guy but even when I was 15 years old I was already shaking my head how so called grown up people can go into fights and even wars, killing one another over a religion, a book, a statement. You'll only live your life once, why not just live it. Have fun, try learning new things every time you can and push yourself to the limits, without getting limited by any form of religion.
We don't need a religion anymore to keep this world spinning. Not even for philosofical purposes. I'm sure all of you can answer philosofical questions better than the bible or any other religious book can.

[doctorfunk]

"Why" questions are philosofical questions and they don't require a god or a religion to be answered. You can be philosofical without having any form of religion, by believing whats in those books people just brainwash themselfs to answer questions of which you are scared to know the actual answer of. Its no problem, I don't mind people believe in such things, I would just like them to keep it for themselfs and not trying to push it on on others.

this hardly relates to what you put in qoute but
I can't disagree that philosofy seeks the answers to fundamental questions.

I'm only 22 years old, still a young guy but even when I was 15 years old I was already shaking my head how so called grown up people can go into fights and even wars, killing one another over a religion, a book, a statement.

They don't, they do it for power, money or land.
Look at history check what drives empires to dominate,
what puts nations against each other. It's not religion mate,
it's the expansion,control, being in power. Not all times,
but that's imo the most often reason.

[Foxdie]

well the story about jesus birth, his miracles, and names people called him was all taken from Egyptian shit


so i just doubted there was anything actually recorded about him outside of religious sources

Edited by Foxdie, 30 June 2010 - 04:31 AM.

[asrael]

you serious :S
Science in general deals tries to anwser question "how?", religion basically tries to show meaning of our existance so
more or less question "why?". You can't prove religion wrong by science, since they operate in different fields.
Secondly stuff written in Bible is not in all cases to be interpreted literally. Creationist or people who believe Earth is flat
are a minority where you can say science proves them wrong, but it is far from how modern believers think about God
and Religion.

My view(short version);
people need to believe, all cultures developed belief systems, "deep seeded need to believe"- as anus would say
so
1. we are so highly inteligent, to keep our mind in balance, we look for purpose to compensate
for our meaningless existance
2. theres idd a God and we do have souls, that's why we all need to search, believe etc
that's a question i've been thinking bout for some time

Science asks itself 'why' questions aswell

[Samuel]

I don't understand how come you people discuss if bible is right or wrong, if it was a humans trick or it was a gods will, when most of you didn't even read it. I mean, what is the point to explain what is music to a deaf person? I myself have read bible and learned it and studied it. And can see all the picture of it. And if you will ever want me to believe that this book has been made just by some guys without knowing eachother to make a super mind controlling book, I doubt theres something which would make me think that. I wouldn't even admit it under danger of death (or lol however u say it). People don't realize that "religion" and "faith" have nothing to do with each other. I've been in many different churches and in "churches" and I know that most of so called faithful people simply don't know god, maybe didn't even read bible at all and are visiting church cause of fears, like death and whatsoever. I honestly belive that most of the religions and confession are on wrong path, cause they didn't read bible well or just define as they want it to be. For example, Judaism. I know lots of rabbis (its not allowed for jews to read new testament in first place) who admitted jesus as their savior and became christians. Also there are rabbis who know that jesus excisted, but they are so addicted to their spot, to their respects, that they are just scared, cause if he will admit it, he will lose everything. In old testament that are dozens of CLEAR sayings about Jesus coming, even a close date. Which makes me make next conclusion of Judaism not admitting jesus: 1. They don't read the Torah properly (they mostly read Talmud, Mishnah and etc, books made by so called sages.) 2. Some of them know deep in their hearts that Jesus was the messiah, but just too afraid to admit it, cause in fact it will be like "Our sages killed Jesus and all 2000 year religion was fake and hand no worth". 3. As I already said they are just afraid to loose their respects and so called honor. As Jesus said about Pharisees "Live like they say, but don't live like they live" Anyway, don't argue please with me if you haven't read the bible, cause everything i say i base on bible after all. I honestly believe that there is no other book like bible. It's magnitude just blows mind. I've read Karan also and it is obvious for me, this book is opposition to bible in Lots of cases. All i try to say is that i see people on internet that whine about bible like all over the place, but no one of those people have actually read the book and studied it. So it's like Tokio Hotel sucks just by seeing those hairy awful looking guys, but never listening to it closely. (btw its one of the worst artist ever on planet). OK now let there be shit on my head. Feel free.

Edited by Samuel, 30 June 2010 - 07:36 AM.

[Foxdie]

I don't understand how come you people discuss if bible is right or wrong, if it was a humans trick or it was a gods will, when most of you didn't even read it. I mean, what is the point to explain what is music to a deaf person? I myself have read bible and learned it and studied it. And can see all the picture of it. And if you will ever want me to believe that this book has been made just by some guys without knowing eachother to make a super mind controlling book, I doubt theres something which would make me think that. I wouldn't even admit it under danger of death (or lol however u say it). People don't realize that "religion" and "faith" have nothing to do with each other. I've been in many different churches and in "churches" and I know that most of so called faithful people simply don't know god, maybe didn't even read bible at all and are visiting church cause of fears, like death and whatsoever. I honestly belive that most of the religions and confession are on wrong path, cause they didn't read bible well or just define as they want it to be. For example, Judaism. I know lots of rabbis (its not allowed for jews to read new testament in first place) who admitted jesus as their savior and became christians. Also there are rabbis who know that jesus excisted, but they are so addicted to their spot, to their respects, that they are just scared, cause if he will admit it, he will lose everything. In old testament that are dozens of CLEAR sayings about Jesus coming, even a close date. Which makes me make next conclusion of Judaism not admitting jesus: 1. They don't read the Torah properly (they mostly read Talmud, Mishnah and etc, books made by so called sages.) 2. Some of them know deep in their hearts that Jesus was the messiah, but just too afraid to admit it, cause in fact it will be like "Our sages killed Jesus and all 2000 year religion was fake and hand no worth". 3. As I already said they are just afraid to loose their respects and so called honor. As Jesus said about Pharisees "Live like they say, but don't live like they live" Anyway, don't argue please with me if you haven't read the bible, cause everything i say i base on bible after all. I honestly believe that there is no other book like bible. It's magnitude just blows mind. I've read Karan also and it is obvious for me, this book is opposition to bible in Lots of cases. All i try to say is that i see people on internet that whine about bible like all over the place, but no one of those people have actually read the book and studied it. So it's like Tokio Hotel sucks just by seeing those hairy awful looking guys, but never listening to it closely. (btw its one of the worst artist ever on planet). OK now let there be shit on my head. Feel free.

explain the video i posted???

[asrael]

I don't understand how come you people discuss if bible is right or wrong, if it was a humans trick or it was a gods will, when most of you didn't even read it. I mean, what is the point to explain what is music to a deaf person? I myself have read bible and learned it and studied it. And can see all the picture of it. And if you will ever want me to believe that this book has been made just by some guys without knowing eachother to make a super mind controlling book, I doubt theres something which would make me think that. I wouldn't even admit it under danger of death (or lol however u say it). People don't realize that "religion" and "faith" have nothing to do with each other. I've been in many different churches and in "churches" and I know that most of so called faithful people simply don't know god, maybe didn't even read bible at all and are visiting church cause of fears, like death and whatsoever. I honestly belive that most of the religions and confession are on wrong path, cause they didn't read bible well or just define as they want it to be. For example, Judaism. I know lots of rabbis (its not allowed for jews to read new testament in first place) who admitted jesus as their savior and became christians. Also there are rabbis who know that jesus excisted, but they are so addicted to their spot, to their respects, that they are just scared, cause if he will admit it, he will lose everything. In old testament that are dozens of CLEAR sayings about Jesus coming, even a close date. Which makes me make next conclusion of Judaism not admitting jesus: 1. They don't read the Torah properly (they mostly read Talmud, Mishnah and etc, books made by so called sages.) 2. Some of them know deep in their hearts that Jesus was the messiah, but just too afraid to admit it, cause in fact it will be like "Our sages killed Jesus and all 2000 year religion was fake and hand no worth". 3. As I already said they are just afraid to loose their respects and so called honor. As Jesus said about Pharisees "Live like they say, but don't live like they live" Anyway, don't argue please with me if you haven't read the bible, cause everything i say i base on bible after all. I honestly believe that there is no other book like bible. It's magnitude just blows mind. I've read Karan also and it is obvious for me, this book is opposition to bible in Lots of cases. All i try to say is that i see people on internet that whine about bible like all over the place, but no one of those people have actually read the book and studied it. So it's like Tokio Hotel sucks just by seeing those hairy awful looking guys, but never listening to it closely. (btw its one of the worst artist ever on planet). OK now let there be shit on my head. Feel free.

So yeah what you are saying is,
don't argue with me because i've read a fictional book and hold it for truth, and you haven't , so i'm better blablablabla

Sounds like a typical religious person excuse to not properly discuss anything to me

[BladHark]

this religious discussion on db is plain ridiculous.

also TL;DR

[Foxdie]

So yeah what you are saying is,
don't argue with me because i've read a fictional book and hold it for truth, and you haven't , so i'm better blablablabla

Sounds like a typical religious person excuse to not properly discuss anything to me

LOOK SAMUEL JUST BECAUSE I HAVENT READ HARRY POTTER I CAN STILL ARGUE ITS FICTION AND I CAN ARGUE WHO THE AUTHOR IS!!!

[doctorfunk]

so i just doubted there was anything actually recorded about him outside of religious sources

there's a post on this very page were I quoted some of other sources, since you asked

Science asks itself 'why' questions aswell

idd I forgot questions "why?" not "how?" universe was created
is what puzzles guys like Hawking :S

So yeah what you are saying is,
don't argue with me because i've read a fictional book and hold it for truth, and you haven't , so i'm better blablablabla
Sounds like a typical religious person excuse to not properly discuss anything to me

no he says most of us know shit about religion and he is right,
you sound like typical nonbeliever with inferiority complex lol.

[Richard]

no he says most of us know shit about religion and he is right,
you sound like typical nonbeliever with inferiority complex lol.

We may not know alot about religion, or a book, but we know enough about it to understand that its just a story.
At this moment I'm not sure about religious people and what they believe in: I think alot of christians don't actualy BELIEVE the science in the bible, and I think the bible is not supposed to be some science book. Then my question would be WHY would you believe in other things the bible says and why would you follow the rules of a book filled with fiction.