287 replies to this topic

[KaSS]

yea .|E deserves a mention for me personally for a few months IIRC in late 2008 they were toughest opponent on sof2, tougher than c4. however it didn't coincide with any team cup

agree

[BladHark]

yea .|E deserves a mention for me personally for a few months IIRC in late 2008 they were toughest opponent on sof2, tougher than c4. however it didn't coincide with any team cup

then again theyve only beaten c4 once ever so FUCK YOU POLACK

(yes im dissing the team i was in for over a year FUCK YOU AGAIN POLACK)

Edited by BladHark, 12 June 2012 - 04:13 PM.

[doctorfunk]

then again theyve only beaten c4 once ever so FUCK YOU POLACK

(yes im dissing the team i was in for over a year FUCK YOU AGAIN POLACK)

1. In 2008 you were 1-2 vs .|E *
source; http://www.donmorrie...=&orderby=adver

2. I said to me personally(meaning for bro|), I'm not sure we ever won them before they died and we've beaten everyone else a few times at least

* according to your www, you are 7-2 vs them still it's ahrd to believe for me that in all these years you've played them only 9times

[BladHark]

one of those games never finished as we only played one side and just put it on te website.

we indeed barely played E as Adrian didnt like playing against (basically) his own team (me zippa lumi navy delta), but when we did play E would always (apart from one time ay) end up losing

[Ming]

then again theyve only beaten c4 once ever so FUCK YOU POLACK

(yes im dissing the team i was in for over a year FUCK YOU AGAIN POLACK)

:DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

[executor]

I have played many wars where the opponent would win the 2nd round with 1 or 2 points more than we did. (It happens when you have played a few thousand wars on this game) And let me tell you, compared to your sample of 1(!) war versus c4, Most of the times a war is lost when you were leading big in start is because the opponent was just better this match.

I find it to be a bit repellent to discuss this stuff about hokie, from both sides. Exe phrased his stuff a bit disrespectful toward the players involved in the story, like they were puppets being played by some Machiavelli. He talks like(which means you didn't phrase it literally like that, but to me the tone was like that) hokie himself was completely perfect and some kind of ubermensch. I think such claims will raise some resistance, it quite disgusts me.

Just chill the fuck out, he was probably a cool dude and did a pretty good job at leading a team. Oh shit, I mean clan(arbitrary distinctions on this game :x)

And you people are all fucking good players, with skills no one others have. You are all special and it's all talents and gifts. Practice had nothing to do with this. No one will reach your level of quick flick sniper shots with a high sens versus low pingers while rushing the roof because a clan tends to not come up so fast. (I had to use your talk as an example executor, since it was very fresh in my memory )

Maybe sometimes the better team just wins, because they have played more together and are in a better shape in the moment of the fight.....

You're right in a lot of ways pino, but I'm not trying to say hokie was perfect, I'm actually trying to say the opposite. Everyone that didn't really know him says shit like he was a great guy, great player, all this retarded, respectful shit that they think they're supposed to say. Truth is he was an arrogant asshole who didn't give a flying fuck about anyone but the few people he knew personally on this game. He was self-centered and manipulative, but there is no denying he was damn good at what he did. He did live his online life in a Machiavellian manner like pino implied, to him everyone was someone who could be controlled or used to his advantage. If he had no use for your sof2 skills, he either wasted no effort being nice to you or used you for his entertainment (there's a reason marty and 98% of estonians hated him). He told me to read the Art of War because it would change the way I looked at most interactions I have with another human being. I haven't got around to buying it and fully reading it all yet, but I'm sure that's why he lived with the online philosophy opposite of lumi's please everyone, never-stir-shit-up attitude. Honestly the reason I enjoy having half you euros hate me is cause I know if hokie is alive, as I believed for the longest time, I know he'd be proud of me carrying on the tradition.  Plus it's like a joker and batman situation.  Did we really hate each other, or did me and c1 just enjoy talking shit to each other because we were rivals and it made the competition feel that much more intense.  If we weren't trash talking we wouldn't know what to say to each other. 

Hok taught me a lot about life, particularly loyalty. Anyone who's read the godfather should understand that there is only one way to control a man who doesn't care about anything. In the book, Luca Brasi is a man who has no fear of death, and roams through life like a wild beast who cannot be controlled (FreeStyle for example). The only way to control this kind of dangerous, carefree person is to give them your allegiance, be the person they consider their closest friend, so they still won't fear death, but they will fear being betrayed by their closest friend, and will give you a type of loyalty you can't get from anyone else in return, so that they'll never be betrayed . Free was a 14 year old kid who played for fun and spoke four words of English, "CARGOOO MUCH peep-hole", but he happened to have the potential to be extremely talented even though he didn't care about competition. Hokie started 3v with free as one of the original members, back when sami was simply some noob from [Eiber]. Since Hok had faith in him and showed him loyalty from the start, by taking the time to talk to him about his personal life and helping him learn the language, free stuck by his side through the tough times, even when it became clear that sami was one of our stronger players and could have left for a more skilled clan. That analogy might go over the head of anyone who hasn't read the Godfather, but hokie understood it and it is the reason why so many people (snugg, staff, xillax) stuck by his side when they didn't need him, even though he needed them. Even though I was in a couple clans with Hokie before he made 3v (prod's -Gz-> and some Code Red clan) he tested me for years, reluctantly let me be a trial in 3v, kicked me out, told me that I played so stupid I should be in special needs classes, pushed me as far as he could to see how much shit I could take from him before I snapped, but he never broke me. I took all his criticism and it made me an infinitely better player, but also a tougher person. When I was the youngest player on my highschool basketball team, I took so much constant abuse from my older teammates, every day, all of them, that I actually almost killed myself, but I never let it break me, because of him.  I was 14.

Hokie hazing me served as an initiation process, until after a few years I earned his loyalty, which was when he opened up and let me see behind the curtain, all the big picture shit he did. He was dying to share his subtle hardwork, since he was a fucking mastermind at making people bend to his will... but in a genuine, honest, friendly way, like Tom Sawyer making you WANT to paint a fence for him, not evil like Voldemort forcing people to do things, even tho that's the way we've come to interpret all of Makaveli or Sun Tzu's lessons in modern times.  He knew what made people tick, and sold them what they wanted.  For example, it was obvious to him that broken took this game super seriously, so he approached him from a "come be part of the greatest clan in this game" angle. He understood that vari was more of a laid-back guy, so he sold him by saying we just play for fun. Both were true.  Since hok was such a competitive person, it wasn't fun unless we were winning. For those of you that say a leader is overrated, that's because you have never played under a true leader. You can argue that a leader is unnecessary, and you would be right. A team of players that are superior in skill to their opponents can function just fine without having one player lead them. However, find them an even opponent that puts up a fair fight, and they will struggle when they face adversity. When things aren't going your way because you're simply not shooting better than the other team is when a leader is valuable, because that's when you need that one person to take charge and bring you together as a team and force you use teamwork to win. True leaders like hokie are rare, especially in videogames since people that tend to play FPS'ers competitively are generally the quiet, reserved types who only grow a pair of grapes on the internet because they're hidden behind their monitor.

 

I'm not surprised most of you think that a leader is irrelevant, since I have only played with two genuine leaders who actually affect the way their team plays and benefits the entire team simply by their presence, and not their individual play. Anyone who played long enough in 3v would agree that we were better when hokie replaced nasta(insert inou, vari, ceto, lauri, whoever you want) even though all of them aim better and simply were better than hokie. Hok had a voice of authority that no one questioned, and he pulled everyone else up to their full potential. If you did something stupid, he would make you feel ashamed of your mistake so you didn't do it again. He knew which players he could criticize, which players he had to encourage, when to be harsh on the team and when to compliment everyone. People responded and played more relaxed when he told the team to chill cause we got this, and when he screamed at everyone to wake the fuck up we certainly took shit more serious. He knew how to stop the bleeding and scrape out a few points when we were over matched on red and couldn't win unless we changed things up. He was playing chess while everyone else was playing checkers. He changed the game tactically, from the strats clans call to the way ALL of sof2 goes ledge gets behind the scaff (all 3v know what I'm talking about)

 hokie would never tolerate any arrogance or the attitude WITHIN the team, where people put their personal score at a higher priority than the team score. The key is that he was unanimously respected as a person by the people that played under him.
Hok had a voice that had to be heard, he always won every argument he engaged in because even if you were right he made you feel like you were a fucking idiot by saying something like even a broken clock is right twice a day. I can't tell you how many times I've heard him say excuses are like assholes, everyone has one. He taught us that if we weren't doing something wrong, we wouldn't need an excuse. It didn't matter how good you were at whoring, hokie wouldn't allow anyone to play like a pussy and wait, watching while their teammates pushed so they could bait them. During wars he would move us around the map like pawns, saying main rush case now and sacrificing two so patio and kitchen could three. He always was aware of the situation, especially since he was usually the first to rush and die, so he would walk everyone else through what to do and the smartest way to handle the situation. He'd keep players like sika and abu from doing anything stupid, like trying to engage in a glitch fight from a bunker when borno was cargo barrels. So yes cam, a leader is unnecessary, but a great leader like Scott Adams is able to bring a team of mediocre players and make them exceed everyone's expectations, and propel them from average to elite.

And turqua that c4 nvm is a great example that proves my point. Both nVm and c4 rely heavily upon their individual play and aim to win, which is successful since those 2 clans have the best 1on1 players/aimers/whores/whatever you want to call them. Although skoko is a good leader in the sense that he has kept together one of the greatest clans to ever play this game, and always attracts incredibly talented players, he is respected for his skill as a player and not his role as a leader. His team might be better when he is playing, but that's mostly because he is one of their best players, and not because his helps c4's teamwork tremendously.

Edited by executor, 02 October 2020 - 08:08 AM.

[SyLt]

WOWWW JUST WOW, EXE REDEFINES THE MEANING OF WALL OF TEXT

[doctorfunk]

entaro adun executor

[katana.]

You're right in a lot of ways pino, but I'm not trying to say hokie was perfect, I'm actually trying to say the opposite. Everyone that didn't really know him says shit like he was a great guy, great player, all this retarded, respectful shit that they think they're supposed to say. Truth is he was an arrogant asshole who didn't give a flying fuck about anyone but the few people he knew personally on this game. He was self-centered and manipulative, but there is no denying he was damn good at what he did. He did live life in a Machiavellian manner like pino implied, to him everyone was someone who could be controlled or used to his advantage. If he had no use for your sof2 skills, he either wasted no effort being nice to you or used you for his entertainment (there's a reason marty and 98% of estonians hated him). He told me to read the Art of War because it would change the way I looked at every interaction I ever have with another human being. I haven't got around to reading it yet, but I'm sure that's why he lived with the philosophy opposite of lumi's please everyone, never-stir-shit-up attitude. Honestly the reason I enjoy having half you euros hate me is cause I know if hokie is alive, as I believed for the longest time, I know he'd be proud of me carrying on the tradition. He taught me a lot about life, particularly loyalty. Anyone who's read the godfather should understand that there is only one way to control a man who doesn't care about anything. In the book, Luca Brasi is a man who has no fear of death, and roams through life like a wild beast who cannot be controlled (FreeStyle for example). The only way to control this kind of person of dangerous, carefree person is to give them your allegiance, be the person they consider their closest friend, so they still won't fear death, but they will fear dying by being betrayed by their closest friend. That analogy might go over the head of anyone who hasn't read the Godfather, but hokie understood it and it is the reason why so many people (snugg, staff, xillax) stuck by his side when they didn't need him, even though he needed them. He tested me for years, to see how much shit I could take from him before I snapped, but he never broke me. It served as an initiation process, until after a few years I finally proved I could be trusted, which was when he opened about all mischievous, devious shit he did. He was dying to share his deceptions, since he was a fucking mastermind at making people bend to his will. He knew what made people tick, and sold them what they wanted to hear. For example, it was obvious to him that broken too this game super seriously, so he approached him from a "come be part of the greatest clan in this game" angle. He understood that vari was more of a laid-back guy, so he sold him by saying we just play for fun. Since hok was such a competitive person, it wasn't fun unless we were winning. For those of you that say a leader is overrated, that's because you have never played under a true leader. You can argue that a leader is unnecessary, and you would be right. A team of players that are superior in skill to their opponents can function just fine without having one player lead them. However, find them an even opponent that puts up a fair fight, and they will struggle when they face adversity. When things aren't going your way because your simply not shooting better than the other team is when a leader is valuable, because that's when you need that one person to take charge and bring you together as a team and force you use teamwork to win. True leaders like hokie are rare, especially in videogames since people that tend to play FPS'ers competitively are generally the quiet, reserved, butcher types who only grow a pair of grapes on the internet where they're hidden behind their monitor. I'm not surprised most of you think that a leader is irrelevant, since I have only played with two genuine leaders (Hokie and >>tacp::Noobiwan) who actually affect the way their team plays and benefits the entire team simply by their presence, and not their individual play. Anyone who played long enough in 3v would agree that we were better when hokie replaced nasta(insert inou, vari, ceto, lauri, whoever you want) even though all of them aim better and simply were better than hokie. Hok had a voice of authority that no one questioned, and he pulled everyone else up to their full potential. If you did something stupid, he would make you feel ashamed of your mistake so you didn't do it again. He knew which players he could criticize, which players he had to encourage, when to be harsh on the team and when to compliment everyone. People responded and played more relaxed when he told the team to chill cause we got this, and when he screamed at everyone to wake the fuck up we certainly took shit more serious. He knew how to stop the bleeding and scrape out a few points when we were over matched on red and couldn't win unless we changed things up. He was playing chess while everyone else was playing checkers. Noobi does the same thing on gold, since he's a grown ass man who gives orders but never takes them. Neither him nor hokie would tolerate any arrogance or the attitude where people put their personal score at a higher priority than the team score. The key is that they are unanimously respected as a person by the people that play under them. Noobi is more probably more intimidating than any person you've ever met, the fact that he walked away from the Latin Kings and is still alive at 36 says enough about him. Hok had a voice that had to be heard, he always won every argument he engaged in because even if you were right he made you feel like you were a fucking idiot by saying something like even a broken clock is right twice a day. I can't tell you how many times I've heard him say excuses are like assholes, everyone has one. He taught us that if we weren't doing something wrong, we wouldn't need an excuse. It didn't matter how good you were at whoring, hokie would not allow anyone to play like a pussy and wait, watching while their teammates pushed so they could bait them. So yes cam, a leader is unnecessary, but a great leader like scott adams is able to bring a team of mediocre players and make them exceed everyone's expectations, until they are among the elite.

The only thing that caught my eye when staring at this novel LOL

[asrael]

Also add #|DiE|# Excite, Lucifer, Steropes, Cyclops, Cohones, Mr. Pork, Dude, Asrael, PsiCopatico, R-Coco or smth

Hahahaha, yes! DiE was awesome!

[TURQUA]

First of all, Sun Tzu is a great writer, he is a man with a vision, but I wouldn't recommend to base your life on it . But I'm pretty sure you used his 36th stratagem often . It's just a book, just like billions of other books, the fact that Hokie took it so serious gives me the impression he had some mental problems. Besides, you are claiming he was a professional at lying and an expert at manipulating. I don't care in how many ways you try to twist it to make it seem like godly characteristics, I see it as the perfect competencies to be qualified as a notorious loser, I'm sure a lot here agree with me.

He knew what made people tick, and sold them what they wanted to hear. For example, it was obvious to him that broken took this game super seriously, so he approached him from a "come be part of the greatest clan in this game" angle. He understood that vari was more of a laid-back guy, so he sold him by saying we just play for fun.

(...)

True leaders like hokie are rare, especially in videogames since people that tend to play FPS'ers competitively are generally the quiet, reserved, butcher types who only grow a pair of grapes on the internet where they're hidden behind their monitor.

(...)

Noobi does the same thing on gold, since he's a grown ass man who gives orders but never takes them. Neither him nor hokie would tolerate any arrogance or the attitude where people put their personal score at a higher priority than the team score. The key is that they are unanimously respected as a person by the people that play under them. Noobi is more probably more intimidating than any person you've ever met, the fact that he walked away from the Latin Kings and is still alive at 36 says enough about him.

A manipulative liar would get his ass whooped the second he'd not live up to an agreement anywhere but behind his screen, so I don't see how Hokie is any different than Butcher. Next to this, your friend who "walked away" from the Latin Kings and is still alive is probably still alive because he wasn't interesting enough for the Latin Kings. If he was really a big shot, if he was really worth the effort of chasing and bringing him down, they would've probably done it already.

[SyLt]

so i just wanna quote my msn convo with professor x

staf says: (10:26:18 PM)
but greece won the ec in 2004 :S
PERSON X says: (10:26:28 PM)
they suck very hard
staf says: (10:26:30 PM)
LOL
PERSON X says: (10:26:40 PM)
no one still knows how they won
PERSON X says: (10:26:41 PM)
its likw hokiw
PERSON X says: (10:26:43 PM)
its like hokie
PERSON X says: (10:26:45 PM)
winnin with 3v
PERSON X says: (10:26:53 PM)
stil debates about it

Edited by SyLt, 16 June 2012 - 08:32 PM.

[executor]

First of all, Sun Tzu is a great writer, he is a man with a vision, but I wouldn't recommend to base your life on it . But I'm pretty sure you used his 36th stratagem often . It's just a book, just like billions of other books, the fact that Hokie took it so serious gives me the impression he had some mental problems. Besides, you are claiming he was a professional at lying and an expert at manipulating. I don't care in how many ways you try to twist it to make it seem like godly characteristics, I see it as the perfect competencies to be qualified as a notorious loser, I'm sure a lot here agree with me.



A manipulative liar would get his ass whooped the second he'd not live up to an agreement anywhere but behind his screen, so I don't see how Hokie is any different than Butcher.

You're taking how he acted in a hostile, competitive environment where he was always treated as an unworthy, fat american outsider for the first 5 years he played, every day, constantly harassed until it hardened his approach to the social politics of the game, and applying it to all aspects of his life.

 

Ya i was writing it in an intentionally blunt, dark tone, but if i tried to explain it as elegantly as snugg did... it would have been written off ass kissing and exaggeration since it's signed exe, who loved him most.  i didn't want the ones that hated 3v. and didnt respect hok to finally understand why we feel so loyal to him.  I just wanted to say fuck you one last time, because I lost my best friend , and those that didn't really know him kept trying to say who he was, or that we're making too big of a deal glorifying his legacy, when he didn't have that big of an impact on the game.  I just wanted to shut those ppl up, but I'm embarrassed for most of the shit i wrote when i was younger, but i understand where it came from

 

Hok truly cared about the few he was personally close to.  That was the magic that made him inspire loyalty the way he did. 

shifty. yosh, snugg, free, murdoc, zioni, even some he didn't expect to like but after spending a lot of time interacting with, definitely ended up caring a lot for, like robban, charles, ph4ze, warren, dena, yanko, rad, m4th, outy, ceto

Edited by executor, 02 October 2020 - 07:03 AM.

[vilzeh]

I'd say Hokie was a psychopath, if thats what exe is saying is true. Manipulative - Check. Didn't care about anyone - Check.

Yep, nutcase.


Lol, football captain, heck, even I were a captain in my football team.

Edited by vilzeh, 16 June 2012 - 09:14 PM.

[TURQUA]

He was the captain of his football team and an actual leader in real life, while butcher probably doesn't have the courage to hit on a girl unless it's over the internet.

You're taking how he acted on a videogame and applying it to all aspects of his life.

[Laffe Herder]

oldskool newskool. ekte dingen.

[@liltunechi]

Point being is : they considered Hokie his friend, only they know how their friend was, others wouldn't know and gave their outlooks on someone's personality based on their actions in a game. The end

[executor]

[quote name='vilzeh' timestamp='1339881208' post='537934']




no.

Edited by executor, 02 October 2020 - 07:26 AM.

[Activee]

yeah well this is an oldschool topic (so i don't see why renegade included himself in 3v) but he did a decent job picking out the original members, and acer if he included every member thats ever been in the list would literally be 75-100 people cause hokie loved to try out unknowns and develop them into overnight allstars (phaze, gandhi, myself) and before active, junior, dr funk, every other sexually frustrated hater has to say something like "you still suck" save it, I've been one of the best in this game with a 150 ping for 6 years now and theres only half a dozen people on the planet who are able to out aim me on sof2 when I have a low ping (rebel,wazd,flow,knuck,yang,usp from >>tacp:: )


I'd love to take a trip to amsterdam to try the bud and see where I stack up against reflex, snugg, zippa, zio, sylt, cam when we have an even ping because on gold i glitch boxes and corners better than bornova, they call me a camper for whoring my 40 ping but they don't deny no one else's aim is as annoying to play against.

For the one known story of how hok stole Snugg from OG, there's a hundred other sneaky stunts he pulled that nobody has heard. He knew how to get what he wanted from people, how to trick them into using them for his advantage or entertainment. Hell he fuckin had defqon bake a cake with "3v pwnz" on it in icing so that he could wear the tags. He convinced a full server that there was this secret wind behind cargo that would blow people back up onto the roof if they jumped at just the right spot, and laughed his ass off while we all fell to our death while him and prod noclipped smoothly back onto the ledge. He let Robban in so that he would help doc make us a movie, he let warren join just so he could use his server, C1 in so that all the actually good polacks would follow (darkness, windows, shivus). He lured in lauri strictly so that staff would join, but latikas, kapu, soul, and broken came as part of the package. He let sika stay in even tho he sucked and added all the avelgem kids(prixx, kkj, phaze) cause it kept snugg from leaving. He tricked ush into thinking he was his best friend even tho he fucking hated the guy, just so he could seduce the sickest aimers from sK into 3v.

At our peak, Lumi was literally the only player left in the game that hok wanted but didn't have, and pep said the only reason he wouldn't join was because we were too stacked already, and he didn't want to kill the competition on sof2. We already had staff, priest, borno, snugg, sylt, xillax, darkness, aytuo, murdoc, lauri, kapu, zioni, ush, free, varmir and pep felt it was unfair, he had to help some clan that I can't remember. Besides Bruce was already in and I'm sure pep just played under his name whenever we needed one, like I did in Haze and RZ for many years (funny how ryan would magically pick up a sniper for the first time in a cupwar and went 14/2) Likewise, there's been times that c4 has been untouchable when they have their best 5 (ref, indo, cam, skok, xillax/lumi) and as someone said .|E was the best in this game at one point, between both clans and teams.

and azzy PONY might have been undefeated but there definitely was some cheaters in it, I'm not saying that they still wouldn't have been the best of their time if they played clean but the wouldn't have won EVERY war the way they did. Besides, they only played 40 wars so that streak wasn't that impressive. During 3v's peak ~2006, hokie had mastered manipulating the elite players in this game by chatting casually about life and discreetly feeding their egos enough that they want to join, 3v won something close to 50 wars without losing one. People didn't understand that hokie was playing chess while everyone else was playing checkers, because hok didn't show his true side to many people. He looked at sof2 like a player, he'd be an asshole to all those that didn't matter and friendly towards the few attractive targets he wanted to fuck, or recruit. I was one of maybe 5 people (abu, yosh, snugg, doc) who actually knew how much of a fucking tactical genius this guy was, not just with understanding how his opponents played and adapting to it but also how amazing he was at manipulating people. (we had specific strategies for each clan, She tact of 2 cargo 1 west 2 pat became famous

Seych say they'll try in the cupwar, they tried but it was still 20-5. No disrespect to she i think they're a great clan and I don't mean to stir shit up with them, I just stumbled across this screenshot and it made me laugh. If you notice hokie saying "n1 zippa" its 110% because he wants zip to feel like he had no help from his teammates so hopefully he'll leave his finnish friends for 3v

You still suck. Btw lumi if you don't want clans to be too stacked come s3'5.

but srsly exe why you brought me into this lol

Edited by Activee, 16 June 2012 - 11:48 PM.

[snugg]

I'm impressed, that text exe wrote is actually a pretty damn good reflection of what it was like back then. Props. Not being too positive or negative about it all, just a true reflection of what was going on.


But those of you who focus on a tiny aspect, 1/1000 of the whole context/story, and then start talking shit (I really cannot think of a generally better way of wording it), why do you say anything at all?

It's obvious your will to listen, to HEAR, is hugely overshadowed by your desire of being right. Regardless of what your viewpoint is.
How can you guys even have that certainty of being right and in arguing against our stories? Some of you weren't even there at the time, the others didn't play with 3v (well, not for a considerable while at least). I feel sorry for you guys if your capabilities of basic LISTENING are the same in real-life. It truly reminds me of 13, 14 year old kids not taking an interest in anything, being rebellious and cool and shit. Come on, I know you guys are mentally older than that.

A friend of mine recently said (about the economical crisis): "I don't really know anything about it, but I have a very clear unchangeable opinion about it." Afterwards, I realised how much of an idiot that guy actually is. Then, I started thinking that's actually applicable to a lot of people. Such as a surprisingly large number of people in this topic. Finally, I was actually quite impressed he said that, cus at least he had the self-insight, the honesty and the guts to say it. He wasn't even drunk or anything. This guy's amazing.

So, isn't it more interesting not just for everyone on here, but also for yourself, if you either talk about something you actually know something about? Or else have the normal decency to either not say anything at all?

Like it's cool and understandable if you have different VIEWS about something like leadership. But so uncool to have a different view about a REAL STORY someone tells. Did you interrupt your grandparents when they were talking about the great war times by saying: "I don't agree, you're talking shit, and now I'm going to make some cynical remarks hahahaha look at me I'm so cool, feed me with attention please.". It's true, they might be exaggerating a bit about their great war times, but their viewpoint is their truth. and their truth is a thousand times more justified, funded and valuable than your ignorant, unknowing, uncontrollable desire to open your mouth and argue that they're wrong.

Peace out

Edited by snugg, 17 June 2012 - 02:42 AM.